Yes, I mean that failing or being accused of using polygraph countermeasures will be detrimental to your ability to maintain your current clearance.
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There is no statistical data available regarding whether having a different polygraph operator is correlated with any particular outcome following an inconclusive polygraph. However, itās possible that the polygraph operator will be under greater pressure to render a pass or fail decision on a third polygraph.
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@AntiPolygraph.org, this should be my last questionā¦ (thank you, by the way)ā¦
What happens if a person āpassesā the second poly, would you then be accused of countermeasures? Which I just donāt think Iām smart enough to even do to be honestā¦lol.
Thanks again for all your help!
Itās not automatic that a person who passes a second polygraph will be accused of having employed countermeasures. But the risk of such an accusation will be higher than during the first session, because the polygraph operator knows that the subject has had both the time and an incentive to research polygraphy.
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@AntiPolygraph.org, that makes a LOT of sense!
Ok, so with that saidā¦ what does another āinconclusiveā reading mean? A 3rd? (Which makes sense as well)ā¦ or does the examiner just report that the subject had two āinconclusive readingsāā¦ and then the BI does their job. To which, it would be up to the adjudicator and the āwhole personā¦ā theory?
@amberbunny, Iād like to hear your perspective on this as well.
A third polygraph may be conducted at the polygraph unitās discretion following two inconclusive outcomes. But passing the polygraph is a requirement. Applicants must ultimately pass in order to receive a security clearance.
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@AntiPolygraph.org, so thatās confusing. If a person passes after the first test being deemed āinconclusiveā or āmore data needs to be collected.ā (Their term, not mine)ā¦ youād be accused of ācountermeasuresā¦ā? So how do you pass without being accused of doing such things?
This entire process is confusing and disheartening to be honest.
I can only speak to my experiences. I tell everyone āexpect two.ā Right now 98% of my submissions get 2. 2% get selected for a third, and of the total, 10 to 15% are called in for an interview to see if they can reasonably determine why there was an odd reading. If it is explainable and reasonable, it is understandable.Some people get tripped up on stupid questions: Do you ever lie, or have you ever stolen an item? I answer yes to both. Everyone lies, and 99% have taken a pen home from work. Goofed off on the clock? Theft of time. SO if you feel even remotely guilty over any of these routine human thingsā¦it can show up in the test. Have you ever abused the office copy machine? Absolutely. Ever print something from home? Yep. As long as it is fair use, there isnāt a problem, but telling a lie about itā¦is the problem. Do I speed? All the time. Ever run a red light? Yep. Knowing I am being watched from a 2 way mirror, and on cameraā¦did I ever check out the female polygrapher when she slowly walked past me? Well, telemetrics donāt lie in that case. Yes I did. My point is donāt sweat the fact you are human. If called in for a follow up interview and one of the questions got real close to an uncomfortable truthā¦discuss it with the adjudicator. If it is reasonableā¦they can make the case and it explains the readings. I had to speak to a few uncomfortable things.
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@amberbunny, thank you. That explains a lot.
I was asked right before the lifestyle portion if there were any serious crimes Iād like to admit to before we startedā¦
Iām a police officer and have been so for 7 yearsā¦I said well, there were times, mostly in the past when I would have a few drinks and drive home. (Iām a father and a husband nowā¦ there just isnāt time to do that type of stuff anymore for me)
(Sorry to say, itās just a part of our culture, it is what it is)
I even explained my drinking habits as a young man and that they have decreased as Iāve gotten older (Iām about to be 35)ā¦
I admitted to this because I wanted to be honest. It was almost like they smelled blood and were out to get me to admit to moreā¦ thereās nothingā¦ as I felt guilty about the behavior because itās NOT a good thing to doā obviouslyā I know this.
Thoughts?
Police officer 28 years. I understand, said same. Asked if I drove intoxicatedā¦hmmm. I did not give myself a breathalyzer. I can honestly then say I was not legally intoxicated. Obviously nobody can give themselves a field sobriety test. At least not objectively. Did I drink more than I should have? Define that. It is easy to get walked down a path where any and every answer comes across as guilty. I understand the stress the line of questioning opens up for you as well. Have I drank alcohol and driven? Yes. 2 glasses of wine over a 3 hour period at a comedy clubā¦am I drunk? Absolutely not. Would it measure on a breathalyzer, Intoxilyzer? Yes. Is it in my opinion to drunk to drive? I cannot answer that. One could argue I did not hit anybody or anything, my responses while driving were optimumā¦but that is hardly a standard for ānot intoxicated.ā I think since there were no DUI tests performed you can tell the adjudicator you may be in someoneās opinion but not necessarily your own, but nervous on the questionā¦
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I did not state that if a person passes after the first test being deemed inconclusive (or that more data needs to be collected), that the person will be accused of using countermeasures. Iām saying that on a second (or third) polygraph, the likelihood of a countermeasure accusation is increased.
Iāve coauthored a free book on polygraphy titled The Lie Behind the Lie Detector that might help answer your questions; it explains polygraph procedure at length. You can find it by Googling the title.
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@amberbunnyā¦
Thank you!
This helps medigate my anxiety some what. Weāll see how it plays, I guess.
(Itās always good to have someone in the family that understands)
No, I have definitely NOT have any DUIsā plus that would be on the record. Iāve never been to āthe farmā¦ā. So, Iāll definitely explain that to the BI or the adjudicatorā¦ If I even make that farā¦lol.
Again, I really appreciate your help and especially your service. 28 years is a long time to make it home each and every night to be with your family!!!
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@AntiPolygraph.org, oh no sir, I wasnāt trying to say you stated that. That was my own assumption, my apologies there. The data collected phrase was used in my poly.
Iāll give the book a google now.
Again, thank you for your patience and quick response times to all my questions.
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They no doubt can be frustrating. Some have a difficult time, swear they donāt meet whatever the magical standard isā¦and they are done, cleared. Others swear they were cool, calm, collected for the entire event and they do not clear. No offense to the author above but I do not recommend reading anything on Poly before going. IMHO, you will act on the information given and must answer honestly on the poly if you researched it at allā¦and that comes across as one looking for counter measures when you just wanted to understand the situation. Iāve sat through 4 of these and did not like one minute of any.
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@amberbunny, you mentioned earlier being able to discuss my side or feelings throughout the poly process. But if I donāt pass any of the polys, how am I supposed to do that? I have yet to even meet with my BI.
Good point. Certainly you can be stopped at many different off ramps. Some agencies clearly use Poly to screen out applicants. My client conducts the BI, followed by Poly. You can be eliminated at the BIā¦I have had calls telling me chances are slim and we cancel processing and I have done so. They can also get to the Poly and quit or show real deception measurements. You will have extreme anxiety, heart pounding, breathing out of rythem or any number of stress indicators to include pauses between answering certain questions. Normally what you think they are measuring, they arenāt. So if there are questions post polyā¦they will call you for an interview to determine if there is an explanation for the nervous readings outside of their definition of the norm. If it makes sense and is logical and no other indicator is there to show otherwiseā¦you can get āclearedā in that interview.
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@amberbunny, youāre a wealth of information.
Iād like to think that it NEVER comes to that for me, but if it doesā¦ Iād definitely like the chance to defend my anxiety.
Thanks again for ALL helpful information.
I would note that over the years, we have heard from many who regret not having researched polygraphy beforehand, and none who regret having educated themselves in advance.
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@AntiPolygraph.org, who would I need to contact to stop the clearance process? Iāve already sent an email to the contracting companyās FSO to declare Iām no longer interested in the job.
Would I also need to contact the
a.) The poly scheduler (who keeps calling)
b.) OPM
Thank you again for your help
I think that by contacting the contractorās Facility Security Officer, you have taken all necessary and appropriate action. Of course, if the polygraph scheduler calls again, I would notify him or her of the changed situation.
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